Board index Experiences, Reviews, Q/A, Discussion Suggestions: What should the BKs be doing? Why don't BKs promote/recommend bidets?

Why don't BKs promote/recommend bidets?


Post Tue May 01, 2012 4:13 am

Posts: 231
Link with BKs: Newcomer
Someone was asking about BK 'post-toilet' washing rules and it made me wonder ... why don't the BKs promote or recommend bidets more?

It might be good for newcomers if someone revised and explained exactly what and why the bottomline is for washing and clothes changing etc according to Shrimat.

I was thinking that in the first place it was just an unquestioned "cultural" habit based on practical reasoning ... but I think it also has deeper purposes and meaning.

However, in the second place, I was thinking how the early expansion into the UK had a deleterious effect on BK habits because of the UK's unclean history, habits and poor sanitation.

OK ... so we have 'number ones' and 'number twos'. After 'number twos' one is supposed to shower and change clothes ... which is somewhere between difficult and impossible for most people, especially at work, and certainly creates a lot of additional work in a climate were many layers of warm clothes are required. Therefore, would I be correct to say Shrimat was modified to allow/encourage just underwear changing in the first place?

Is this even a habit which is still taught/encouraged these days ... and if so at what point in one's BK life?

Now, in India and much of Asia, paper is out and jars of water are in which, again, has very good and practical logic behind it ... but it just made me think to ask about bidet use as a better compromise. Surely the leadership must have encountered them "sur le Continent" ... or at one of those high class 5 star hotels they increasingly go to in the Middle East etc.

Has anyone shown them how to use one ... or do they go on holiday with a bucket and jam jar instead of a bucket and spade?

(FYI, I am very pro ... and not in anyway critical of ... squeaky clean butt holes and think washing with water is a far better way to go then the arrogant and wasteful chopping down and bleaching of all those trees just to make toilet paper.)
As soon as souls indulge in vice, they experience bad omens. Their intellect is locked up. This is an incognito, severe punishment. Then such souls would never be able to say, "God says that lust is the greatest enemy". SM 2003/09/02


Posts: 231
Link with BKs: Newcomer
And while were are "scrapping the bottom" of conversation topics ... the whole business of delineating between what one used one's right hand and left hand for always seemed to be typical of the illogical or disconnected thinking within the BKWSU in the West.

I mean, in India it makes sense. You use your left hand to wipe you bottom and deal with "dirty" bits ... and you use your right hand to deal with eating and accepting prasad (toli).

That is logical. It makes perfect sense.

Then in the Western Order of the BKWSU ... at some point at least just before you go to Madhuban, some more senior BK catches you coming out of the toilet at some point and gives you a discrete chit chat about the etiquette of bottom washing etc.

However, I don't remember anyone telling me or others about left and right hand use and I bet 99% of Western BKs, and many Westernised Indians, are using their right hand to do all three ... wipe, eat, take toli (not necessarily in that order).

It is disgusting ... it is no undignified. Devout Hindus would be horrified.

Is any one policing this?

And what are you supposed to do if you are left handed? Is it possible to democratically appoint one hand to be clean and the other not according to one's own personal taste?
As soon as souls indulge in vice, they experience bad omens. Their intellect is locked up. This is an incognito, severe punishment. Then such souls would never be able to say, "God says that lust is the greatest enemy". SM 2003/09/02

VisionOfSelf User avatar
Site Admin

Posts: 691
Link with BKs: BK
Bidet is a fair recommendation, thanks

paramsingh wrote:
Then in the Western Order of the BKWSU ... at some point at least just before you go to Madhuban, some more senior BK catches you coming out of the toilet at some point and gives you a discrete chit chat about the etiquette of bottom washing etc.

Really? -- not true at least for me. I was told in a casual conversation that I should take a shower after number two for hygiene purposes, just like ensuring nails are properly cut before cooking bhog.

paramsingh wrote:
OK ... so we have 'number ones' and 'number twos'. After 'number twos' one is supposed to shower and change clothes ... which is somewhere between difficult and impossible for most people, especially at work, and certainly creates a lot of additional work in a climate were many layers of warm clothes are required. Therefore, would I be correct to say Shrimat was modified to allow/encourage just underwear changing in the first place?

Again, really? I have been with the BKs for more than 10 years and I can tell you that if I have to go number two at work, I don't do anything special :shock: I just take a shower after I come back home. Have learned through the years to take life easy :lol:

paramsingh wrote:
However, I don't remember anyone telling me or others about left and right hand use and I bet 99% of Western BKs, and many Westernised Indians, are using their right hand to do all three ... wipe, eat, take toli (not necessarily in that order). ... Is any one policing this?

There is no policing done anywhere as far as I have seen on any principles.
Nobody if going to police amritvela or whether I am eating from outside etc. etc.
It's one's own personal choice IMO.
But certainly I see your recommendation to suggest that they use DIFFERENT hands for hygiene purposes.


Posts: 231
Link with BKs: Newcomer
VisionOfSelf wrote:
... just like ensuring nails are properly cut before cooking bhog.

Really? You see ... I've never seen or heard of that one! Is that for sisters only?

Who told you that !?! It sounds like some clean freak was being really anal ... or else you tried to cook dinner after you had cleaned your bicycle.

Surely there should be a little bit of standardisation somewhere down the line? Has no one written the definitive "Dummy's Guide to being a Brahma Kumari" yet?

I was always aware of the 'left hand' 'right hand' stuff (sinistra et dextra ... sinister and dexter ... it was not just an Indian thing either) as I had an interest in Hinduism and anthropology long before the BKs crossed my path. I think it is perfectly practical and logical within its cultural context. I was always amazed how few Westerners 'got it' or understood it though and blissful in their ignorance stuck out their bottomwiper to receive toli. Although their might have been an external following of the form, there was little understanding.

Touching people with your feet was another taboo I once got pulled up on. I was mildly offended because my foot was a lot clean than their hand. Again, "feet = unclean" also makes sense in India.

Call me old school but it sounds like standards have gotten lower not better.

I am still thinking this quality of "clean" versus "unclean" has more depth to it than just physical hygiene.
There is no policing done anywhere as far as I have seen on any principles ... It's one's own personal choice IMO.

Presumably you are not in India, and not living in a center then? I am keeping the bigger picture of Bk adherence in mind. Does everyone else agree no "policing" goes on?

It is way off topic but are you really tell me that it is all down to "personal choice" for all those kunyas signing up as sevadharis?
As soon as souls indulge in vice, they experience bad omens. Their intellect is locked up. This is an incognito, severe punishment. Then such souls would never be able to say, "God says that lust is the greatest enemy". SM 2003/09/02


Posts: 231
Link with BKs: Newcomer
Is there one single place where "the rules" are written out clearly and simply for all to see?

If not, what is the rational behind the way in which they are administered?
As soon as souls indulge in vice, they experience bad omens. Their intellect is locked up. This is an incognito, severe punishment. Then such souls would never be able to say, "God says that lust is the greatest enemy". SM 2003/09/02


Posts: 61
Link with BKs: ex-BK
There are two reasons why a Bidet should be used : Number 1 and Number 2.


Posts: 869
Link with BKs: -
I thought no. 2s were the number one reason.


Posts: 61
Link with BKs: ex-BK
when I broke my shoulder I could not use my right arm any more even after it healed. I ended up using baby wipes. These are almost as good as a wash.


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