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The knowledge, events, incidents and mysteries



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21) 100 marks is reserved just to God- and not to human souls- Post No. 128 - viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1167&p=12500&hilit=marks#p12500

22) Most beloved Father gives fruit/response instantly. Father would be with children till the task of establishment is completed:-

AM 21-6-82(1, 2):- (Revised date- full murli is below):- Aaj smruti divas arthaath samarthi divas sab bachchon ne apni2 lagan anusaar bhinn2 roop se yaad kiyaa. Baapdada ke paas chaaron vor ke snehi, sahayogi, shakti swaroop, samparkvaali aatmaa ke sab roop ki yaad vatan tak pahunchi. Baapdada dwara harek bachche ko jaisee yaad vaisaa return usee samay mil jaataa hai. Kayi bachche yogi tu atma ke bajaaye viyogi aatmaayein ban jaate hain jis kaaran milan ke bajaaye judaayi ka anubhav karte hain. YOGI TU ATMA SADAA BAAPDADA KE DIL TAKHTHNASHEEN HOTI. DIL KABHI DUR/DOOR NAHIN HOTI. Viyogi aatmaayein viyog ke dwara Baapdada ko saamney lane ka prayatn karti hain. Vart_maan ko bhool beeti ko yaad karti hai. IS KAARAN BAAAPDADA KAB PRATYAKSH DIKHAAYI DETE, KAB PARDEY KE ANDAR CHIPAA HUVAA DIKHAAYI DETE. LEKIN BAAPDAADAA SADAA BACHCHON KE AAGE PRATYAKSH HAIN. BACHCHON SE CHIP NAHIN SAKTAA. JABKI BAAP HAI HI BACHCHON PRATI. JAB TAK BACHCHON KA STHAAPNAA KA KARTAVY KA PART HAI TAB TAK BAAPDADA BACHCHON KE HAR SANKALP AUR SECOND MAY SAATH2 HAI. Baap ka vaaydaa hai saath chalenge. Kab chalenge? Jab kaary samaapth hoga. TOH PAHLEY HI BAAP KO KYON BHEJ DETE HAIN? BAAP CHALAAA GAYA- YAH KAH AVINAASHI SAMBANDH KO VINAASHI KYON BANAATE HO? SIRF PART PARIVARTAN HUVAA HAI. JAISE AAP LOG BHI SEVA STHAAN CHANGE KARTE HO NA. TOH BRAHMA BAAP NE BHI SEVA STHAAN CHANGE KIYAA HAI. ROOP VAHI, SEVA VAHI HAI. HAZAAR BHUJAAVAALEY BRAHMA KE ROOP KA VARTMAAN SAMAY PART CHAL RAHA HAI. TAB TOH SAKAR SRUSHTI MAY IS ROOP KA GAAYAN AUR YAADGAAR HAI. BHUJAAYEIN BAAP KE BINAA KARTAVY KAR NAHIN SAKTI. BHUJAAYEIN BAAP KO PRATYAKSH KARAA RAHI HAIN. KARAANEVAALAA HAI, TAB TOH KAR RAHE HAIN. JAISE ATMA KE BINAA BHUJAA KUCH NAHI KAR SAKTI, VAISE BAAAPDAA COMBINED SOUL KE BINAA BHUJAAYEN ROOPI BACHCHE KYAA KAR SAKTEY HAIN? HAR KARTAVY MAY ANTH TAK PAHLEY KAARY KA HISAA BRAHMA KA HI TOH HAI. BRAHMA ARTHAATH ADI DEV. ADI DEV ARTHAATH HAR SHUBH KAARY KI AADI KARNEVAALAA. BAAPDADA KE AADI KARNE KE BINAA ARTHAATH AARAMBH KARNE KE BINAA KOYI BHI KAARY SAFAL KAISE HO SAKTAA? HAR KAARY MAY PAHLEY BAAP KA SAHAYOG HAI. ANUBHAV BHI KARTE HO, VARNAN BHI KARTE HO, PHIR BHI KAB2 BHOOL JAATE HO. PREM KE SAAGAR MAY PREM KE LAHARON MAY KYAA BAN JAATE HO? Laharon se khelnaa hai, na ki laharon ke vashibhooth honaa hai. GUNGAAN KARO, LEKIN GHAAYAL NAHIN BANO. BAAP DEKH RAHE HAIN KI BACHCHE MERAA SAATHI HAIN AUR BACHCHE JUDAAYI KAA PARDAA DAAL DEKHTE RAHTE HAIN. PHIR DHOONDHNEY MAY SAMAY GAVAATE HAIN. HAAJIRAA HAJOOR KO BHI CHIPAA LETE HAIN. Agar aankh michouni ka khel achchaa lagtaa hai toh khel samajhkar bhaley khelo lekin swaroop nahin bano. BAHLAANEY KI BAATEIN NAHIN SUNAA RAHE HAIN. AUR HI SEVA KI SPEED KO ATI TEEVR GATI DENE KE LIYE SIRF STHAAN PARIVARTAN KIYAA HAI. Isliye bachchon ko bhi Baap samaan seva ki gati ko ati teevr banaane may busy rahnaa chaahiye. Yah hai sneh ka return. Baap jaante hain bachchon ko Baap se ati sneh hai. LEKIN BAAPKA BACHCHON KE SAATH2 SEVA SE BHI SNEH HAI. BAAP KE SNEH KA PRATYAKSH SWAROOP SEVA SE SNEH HAI. JAISE PAL2 BABA2 KAHTE HO VAISE HAR PAL BAAP AUR SEVA HO. TAB HI SEVA KA KAARY SAMAAPTH HOGAA AUR SAATH CHALENGE. AB BAAPDADA HAREK BACHCHE KO LIGHT MIGHT HOUSE KE ROOP MAY DEKHTE HAIN. MIKE POWERFUL HO GAYE HAIN. LEKIN LIGHT, MIGHT AUR MIKE TEENON HI POWERFUL SAATH2 CHAAHIYE. AWAAZ MAY AANAA SAHAJ LAGTAA HAI NA. AB AISEE POWERFUL STAGE BANAAVO JIS STAGE SE HAR ATMA KO SHAANTHI, SUKH, AUR PAVITRATAA KI TEENON HI LIGHTS APNI MIGHT SE DE SAKO. JAISE SAAAKAARI SRUSHTI MAY JIS RANG KI LIGHT JALAAATE HO TOH CHAARON VOR VAHI VAATAAVARAN HO JAATAA HAI. AGAR HARI LIGHT HOTI HAI TOH CHAARON VOR VAHI PRAKAASH CHAA JAATAA HAI. EK STHAAN PAR HOTE HUYE BHI EK LIGHT VAATAAVARAN KO BADAL DETI HAI. JAISE AAP LOG BHI JAB LAAL LIGHT KARTE HO TO AUTOMATICALLY YAAD KA VAAYUMANDAL BAN JAATAA HAI. AISE JAB STHOOL LIGHT VAAYUMANDAL KO PARIVARTAN KAR LETI HAI TOH AAP LIGHT HOUSE PAVIITRATA KI LIGHT SE VA SUKH KI LIGHT SE VAAYUMANDAL NAHIN BANAA SAKTEY HO? STHOOL LIGHT AANKHON SE DEKHTE. RUHAANI LIGHT ANUBHAV SE JAANENGE. VARTMAAN SAMAY ISEE RUHAANI LIGHT HOUSE DWARA VAAYUMANDAL PARIVARTAN KARNE KI SEVA HAI. SUNAAA AB SEVA KA KYAA ROOP HONA HAI? MIKE BAHUT HAIN, SPEED BHI HAI. LEKIN ATTENTION SWAYAM KI LIGHT AUR MIGHT SWAROOP PAR HO. DONON SEVA SAATH HO. MIKE AUR MIGHT. TAB SAHAJ SAFALATAA MOORTH BAN JAAYENGE. SADAA ATEENDRIY SUKH VA KHUSHI KE JHOOLEY MAY JHOOLTEY RAHO. KHUSH RAHO AUR KHUSHI KA DAAN DETE RAHO. NA DEH ABHIMAAN KI MITTI MAY AAVO, NA DEH ABHIMAANI SAMBANDH MAY AAKAR MITTI SE KHELO. BUDDHI ROOPI PAAV MITTI MAY NAHIN RAKHO. DIL TAKHTHNASHEEN BACHCHE KAB MITTI MAY NAHIN KHELTEY. SADAA GYAAN RATNON SE KHELTE RAHO. Achchaa -72, 72- [yaad, dhaarnaa, seva, God’s acts, pbks]

23) If not in corporeal, 100 years of role of establishment will continue through subtle. - Post No. 92- murli point No. 5 - - viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1167&p=12005&hilit=pooraa#p12005

24) - How does Shivbaba give srimath/suggestions personally ? Post No. 158 - viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1167&p=13468&hilit=pooraa#p13468


25) Baba says- my chariot is fixed, I enter only one. But, if in drama, there is need to bring benefit to someone, I enter in some children as well (like side scenes)

SM 13-4-78(2):- AISEY NAHI BRAHMA BABA KO YAAD KARNE SE VARSAA MILEGAA. THUR BHI NAHIN MILEGAA. ……….. Tum kahaan murli chalaaney may moonjh jaavenge toh bhi Shivbaba pravesh kar aaye murli chalaavenge. Bachchon ko pataa nahin padtaa ki shivbaba aakar madad karte hain. Samajhte hain humney aaj murli achchi chalaayi. Arey- aaj achchi chalaayi, kal kyon nahin chalaati thi? Tumko yah bhi pataa thode hi padti hai shivbaba bolthay hain yaa brahma bolthay hain. Shivbaba kahte hain bachche toh merey Ishwariy owlaad hain. Merey ko yaad karo. Aisey aur koyi kah na sakey. Main hi inmay pravesh kar kah saktaa hun. Main gyaan saagar hun na. Tum gyaani tu aatmaa ban rahe ho. MAIN TOH PRERAK HUN. Humko kiskaa kalyaan karnaa hai toh unmay pravesh kar baith sunaataa hun. Jo Baap se yog rakhte hain toh Baap bhi aakar madad karte hain………Aisey math samjho yah Brahma baba direction dete hain.shivbaba yaad rahnaa hai. -86-. 87 [murli, yaad, entrance, prerana, god’s acts]


26) Father is not a physical doctor, but if in drama, may also give some directions on that :-

SM 26-4-87(73-):- Mera kaam hai shikshaa denaa. Main toh teacher hun. Aisey nahin Baba toh jaante hain, humaari davaayi aape hi bhej denge. Baba kahenge beemaari hai toh doctor ke paas jaavo. HAAN SABSEY ACHCHI DAVAAYI HAI YOG. BAAKI MAIN KOYI DOCTOR HUN KYAA JO DAVAAYI BAITH DOONGAA. HAAN KAB DE BHI SAKTAA HUN DRAMA MAY NOONDH HAI TOH. Baaki main tumhaaree atma ko injection lagaaney aayaa hun. DRAMA MAY HAIN TOH KAB DAVAAYI DE BHI DETE HAIN. Baaki aisey nahin Baba Samarth hai, humaari beemaari ko kyon nahin chudaa saktey hain. Bhagavaan toh jo chaahe so kar saktaa hai. Nahin. Baap toh aate hee hain patiton ko pavan banaaney. Achchaa. -73- [God’s acts, repeat, yaad]


27) Father gives fruit of bhakti even in bhaktimarg:-

SM 21-10-82(2):- Bhakti may jo kuch bhhaavnaa se karte hain uskaa phal kuch na kuch Baap dete hain. Doosrey janm may achchaa bhakt ban jaate hain. -54- [God’s acts, inf]

28) Father also helps children a lot:-

Many times, Baba says- I cannot do anything, all depends on drama. But, baba also says I help children a lot. The main thing- what baba needs is- children SHOULD NOT BEG EVEN FROM GOD. DO NOT EXPECT EVEN FROM GOD. HAVE FAITH THAT BOTH DRAMA, AND SHIVBABA ARE KALYAANAKAARIS(AUSPICIOUS). Baba has also said- There is no need to remind God. Humans may need to remind about their duty. Also- when God gives, it is hundred folds.

SM 25-1-83(1):- Bachchon se saakshaatkaar bhi kiyaa hai jo achchi reeti yaad karte hain Baap unhon_ki rakshaa bhi karte hain. DUSHMAN KO BHAYANKAR ROOP DIKHAAYE BHAGAA DETE HAIN. Tumko jab tak sharir hai tab tak yog may rahnaa hai. Nahin toh sajaayein khaani padengi. -35 [yaad, vision]

= Children have got vision- how Shivbaba helps righteous children. Baba shows a ferocious form to the enemy and makes them run away. .....

29) Baba also says- in Conf. Age God is bound to give all the things- powers and virtues to children. So, use God fully.
Baba also says- I have given you everything as your birth right. Just realize birth (feel that you are child of God), and you will experience it.

30) There is also a murli point which says- If you say My baba from heart, Shivbaba is at your service.
Baba also says- I am your most obedient servant. But, I will not show you krupa (free gift). What I teach you itself is the real krupa. You then do krupa on make yourself by inculcating the study.

31) Baba usually says in sakar murlis- himmatey bachchey madadey khudaa = As the courage of the children, so is the father's help.
There is a very important avyakt murli point on courage- (in approximate words). Most beloved baba says- "See, when a child is asked to cut cake, usually it is parents who cut the cake, but the child has to be ready at least to hold the knife. It is parents who apply force, child need not apply the force. Similarly, you children should show courage at least to that extent. Rest baba will do everything for you. If you do not show even that much courage, how can Baba give you certificate? Worldly people will complain- how can God give property only to you?"

32) Baba also gives example of the kittens which were fully safe even when they had been in the pot which were on fire to bake it. So- Baba has promised us that- even in the worst circumstances children will be safe.

33) Father is also cautious and concerned about the children

SM 19-11-82(3):- BAAP KAHTE HAIN MUJHE KITNI MEHNATH KARNI PADTI HAI, KITNAA ONAA RAHTAA HAI. Kahaan koyi bachchi gundon ke haath may na aa jaave. Duniyaa bahut gandi/gundi hai. CENTRE PAR GUNDEY AA JAATE HAIN. NAAM ROOP MAY FAS PADTEY HAIN. Yagy may anek prakaar ke vighn bhi padtey hain. Maya bhi vighn daalti hai. Phir bahut ghutkaa khaate hain. Phir bhi Baap ko yaad karnaa padey. YUDDH KE MAIDAAN MAY KHADEY HOKAR LADNAA HAI. Darnaa nahin hai. FAARKATI BAHUT DE DETE HAIN. KITNEY VARSH RAH PAALNAA LE PHIR SHAADI KAR KAHAAN KAA KAHAAN CHALEY GAYE. Aashcharyavanti bhaaganti ho jaate hain. PHIR BHI DRAMA KI BHAAVI KAH CHUP HO JAATE HAIN. Service may rahneyvaalon ko khushi jaasthi rahti hai. -95 [warning, god’s acts, baith]


34) Destruction is fixed in drama, but lowkik people consider it to be Godly Act:-

SM 15-1-77(3):- Natural calamaties ko Godly act kahaa jata hai. Shankar dwara vinash. To Godly act huvaa na. Direction dete hain yah sab udaa do. Baap kahte hain main koyi direction detaa nahin hun. Yah to drama may noondh hai. -18-

= People believe natural calamaties as Godly act. (It is said) destruction through Shankar. Then it is (looks like) godly act, is it not? (It then looks as if God or Shankar) gives direction to destroy all these. But, Baba says- I do not give such directions. It is fixed in drama.

35) God is most loved, and most defamed by Bharatvaasis:-

SM 15-2-89(3):- Baap toh hai hee gareeb nivaaz. Daan bhee gareebon ko hee diyaa jaataa hai. BAAP KHUD KAHTE HAIN MAIN BHEE SAADHAARAN TAN MAY AATAA HUN. NA GAREEB, NA SAAHUKAAR. Tum bachche hee Baap ko jaante ho. Baaki saaree duniyaa toh gaalee detee rahtee hai. BAAP KAHTE HAI BHAARATAVAASIYON KO DRAMA MAY PART HAI GAALEE DENE KAA, GAALEE KARNE KAA. JIS BHAARAT KO ITNAA OONCHAA SWARG BANAAYAA UNHONEY HEE BAHUT GLAANEE KEE HAI. Tikkar, bittar may thok diyaa hai. Baap aisaa dharm sthaapan karte hain jo vahaan dukh kaa naam bhee naheen rahegaa. JINKO SUKH DETAA HUN, VAHEE KAANTE BAN MERI GLAANI KARTE, GAALIYAAN DETE HAIN. Devataavon kee bhee glaani karte hain. -62 [Rath, God’s acts, Bharat]

Post No. 197 viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1167&p=15375&hilit=foundation#p15375

35) God adopts/corrects a scripture too- not just children*. So, it is a COMPLETE PROCESS AND FULL TRANSFORMATION.
- Post No. `11 - viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1167&p=4061&hilit=foundation#p4061


* - God adopts/transforms the Iron Aged World too into Golden Age.
Murli Pt:- Gambheerataa se full marks jamaa hota hai. Mamma toh gambheerataa kee devi thi. = The virtue seriousness gives full marks. Mamma was a deity of seriousness.


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# Post No. 210) Few thoughts about "BrahmTATW, BrahmAAND, and BrahmLOK:-


All are one and the same. Brahm_Lok = Brahmaand = Brahm_Tatw = Paramdham

Tatw = element

There are two worlds- Physical/Corporeal World (PW = CW) and Incorporeal. world (IW) . [Subtle world is only temporary- during Conf. Age].

In CW- there are five elements- earth, fire, air, water and ether (space). The space in the CW/PW is called as aakaash.

In IW - it is just space which is called as - Brahm tatw. [The space in CW gets degraded, polluted, but space in IW does not, it remains always pure]. Hence it is supreme abode. .

1) Murli point says- Aatmaa Paramadham may andey misal rahti hain = In Paramdham, souls reside like egg shaped.

Soul is shown as both point, as well as oval/egg shape.

Since soul is seed, it is given egg/oval shape. Actually it is point.
2) Mostly, there is also a murli point saying- "Aatma andaa misal naheen hai, vah toh bindu hai. = Soul is not egg shaped, it is point"

In lowkik, the both the words "brahm_aand" and "brahm_tatw" are famous. [andaa = egg, andey = eggs -plural]

In lowkik, another name for Brahm-tatw is "NIR_GUNN (No Gunn = No quality) Brahm". Some (mainly saints) believe the PW is "SAGUN (one that has quality) Brahm".
Hence they believe Nirgunn Brahm as always pure, and Sagun Brahm changes its state.

They believe - initially or at some point of time, it would be just sagun brahm (IW) only. They also believe sagun Brahm (PW) is only a small part which got emerged from nirgun brahm (IW).

The right word is BRAHM_TATW or BRAHM_LOK, not BRAHMAAND.
Brahm stands for the highest seat. EG- Like- brahmaanand (highest bliss), brahm muhoorth (highest time)

I do not know from where the name BRAHMAAND came. Mostly since the soul is believed to be egg or thumb shaped, and since souls reside there, that name might had come.

Another reason could be - Since the brahm tatw is said to be the seed(origin, parent*) for the creation of the PW - Since lowkik people believe the PW has come out (emerged) from brahmaand, they might had called brahm-tatw as brahmaand .

* - Egg may mean parent house. Like a chicken comes out of an egg, they may be believing the PW has come out from IW.

Some saints believe Brahm_tatw itself to be Ishwar/God. They meditate only on just on the Pure Space Brahm Tatw. That is why baba calls them as tatw_gyaanis = inclined only to the pure space. Their aim is to become leen/merged with Brahm_Tatw.

"Brahma" is different than "Brahm". Brahma is name of the first person (number one human being), whereas Brahm is the name of just/highest space.
Murli Pt:- Gambheerataa se full marks jamaa hota hai. Mamma toh gambheerataa kee devi thi. = The virtue seriousness gives full marks. Mamma was a deity of seriousness.


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Post No. 211) "Liberation in-life" in a Second:-

Baba usually says- Second may jivanmukti = liberation in-life (achievable) in a second". Some may ask- did we get "liberation in-life" in a second?

1 It means - as soon as we get faith on Baba/knowledge, a sanskaar of that is recorded in soul which reserves a seat for us in heaven. That is why ---

---Baba says- Ek baar Mamma-Baba kahaa, varse ke hak_daar banaa = Even if you say Mamma-Baba once , you become eligible for the property.

---Baba also says- those who drink knowledge even a little will get eligibility to come to heaven which is called as liberation in life.

----The same is said even in the following murli point.

SM 2-1-75(1):- Bhal gaayan hai second may jivan_mukti. Baap ka bachcha bana aur varsaa. Ek baap pahchaan_kar kaha yah PPB hai. Brahma vald Shiv. Nishchay karne se hee varsaa ho jata hai. Phir agar koyi akartavy karenge toh sajayein bahut khaani padengi. -2-

= There is saying liberation in life in a second. Once you become child of the father, then property (in understood). Once you realize the father (Shiv) and say- this is Prajapita Brahma. Brahma vald Shiv. Property gets fixed as soon as you develop faith. .....

2) Another meaning/view/point - is 1) It means we get got job/food instantly (hence can be called as "in a second"). But, to earn enough money, or eat food, digest it - it takes time.

[A similar murli point on Karmaateet stage is said - point No. 13 in Post No. 200 - viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1167&hilit=liberation&start=270].


3) Baba is explaining- "In bhakti- it is said so. Hence baba first speaks it then explains the essence in it. But, actually it takes time.

SM 14-11-89(1):- BHAL, GAAYAN HAI SECOND MAY JEEVANMUKTI. PARANTU ISMEY MEHNATH BAHUT HAI. ATMA ABHIMAANI NA BAN_NE SE TUMHAAREY VACHANON MAY TAAKATH NAHIN RAHTI HAI. Kyonki jis prakaar Baap samjhaate hain, us reeti koyi samjhaate nahin hai. -58- [yaad, second] –imp

= Of course, there is gaayan/saying "Liberation in life in a second". But, there is LOT OF EFFORT in this. Due to not being in soul conscious, there would be no power in your words/speech. Because no one teaches the way Baba teaches.

But, for top souls, it takes less time. Their life would have become stable very soon in the path of knowledge, and will be stable till the beginning of Copper Age of next kalpa.
Murli Pt:- Gambheerataa se full marks jamaa hota hai. Mamma toh gambheerataa kee devi thi. = The virtue seriousness gives full marks. Mamma was a deity of seriousness.


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Post No. 212) "Paritraanaayaam Saadhunaam" in Sanscrit/Lowkik Gita:-

1) In lowkik Gita, in chapter 04, sloka 08, Godly versions speak - "Paritraanaayaam Saadhoonaam"" = "I come to uplift/protect even Saadhus/saints".

This is a riddle for Gita preachers to explain. Because it places the saints at low level. In Bharat/India, the lowkik Gurus have made people believe- the saints and human Gurus and the so-called Jagadgurus are like liberators. They sometimes even place human Gurus above God.


2) At one place I have heard a preacher saying - Sadhus are already protected! [I was surprised- as it goes against the sloka].
We can see erroneous/different translation at different places.

a) http://www.bhagavad-gita.org/Gita/verse-04-08.html- We can see - the word SADHU is erroneously translated. They have written DEVOTEES instead of SADHUS/SAINTS

"For the protection of DEVOTEES and annihilation of the miscreants and to fully establish righteousness, I appear millennium after millennium".

b) http://thegita.net/thegita-chapter-4-shloka-8/ - Here the translation is Ok.

"O Arjuna, I appear on earth from time to time for three main purposes. The first is for the protection and preservation of all that represents good, and of all those PURE and SAINTLY people on earth. The second purpose for which I appear on earth is for the destruction and removed and wrong-doers.
The third purpose is, of course, for the establishment and creation (or recreation) of Dharma (Righteousness or reinstating moral values among people on earth.) "


But, even if the translation is Ok, it is still a question- do pure and/or knowledgeable people need any protection? They would be spiritually powerful, is it not.

3) Baba explains-

SM 8-11- 72(2):- ShivBaba ko toh apnaa sharir hai nahin. VAHAAN MANDIR MAY BHI LING RAKHAA HAI. Dilwaalaa mandir ka arth koyi samajh nahin sakte hain. Adhar kumaariyaan, kumaari kanyaa bhi hain. Sikhlaanevaale Baap ka bhi chitr hai. Swarg ka malik banaevaalaa zaroor ustaad chahiye. Vahaan Krishn ki baath nahin. JAHAAN Brahma BAITHAA HAI VAHAAN Krishna KAISE AA SAKTAA HAI? Krishn ki atma tapasya kar rahi hai sundar ban_ne liye. Brahma hai Shyaam. Oopar may Vaikunth ke sundar chitr khade hain. Braahman braahmanyiaan hee phir devtaa banenge. Yah dilwaalaa mandir sabhi se oonch hai. Unko sikhlaanevaalaa ShivBaba hai. Somnaath somras gyaan amrut pilaate hain. Mandiron may unkey paav dhokar phir amrut samajh kar peetey hain. Yah to gyaan ki baath hai. Paani ki baath nahin. STREE BHI PATI KE CHARAN DHOKAR PEETI HAI. PATI KE SIVAAYE KISKO NAHIN POOJTI. Bharat MAY AISAA THAA. YAH TO BAAD MAY SANYAASI, AADI, DAAKOO LOG AAYE HAIN, JINHONEY ULTAA AAKAR SAMJHAAYAA HAI. APNI CHARAN BAITHKAR PUJVAATE HAIN. Apney ko Ishwar maantey patit ho gaye hain. Tab to Baap kahte hain in saadhuvon ka bhi udhdhaar karne main aataa hun. -10, 10- [ShivBaba, dilwaalaa, inf, Krishn]

= ....Where there is Brahma, how can Krishn come there? The soul of Krishn is doing 'tapasya' in order to become beautiful. Brahma is Shyam. At the top sundar/beautiful pictures of Heaven are shown. Braahmins themselves become deities. ...Somnath gives you somras, the nectar of knowledge. In temples, devotees wash his feet an drink the water. (But), this is matter of knowledge, not of water. The wife also washes the feet of the husband and drinks same. She does not revere anyone other than her husband. It was like that in Bharat. These Sanyasis, and others, who are DACOITS, have come later, and explained in a topsy-turvy way. They make/made devotees worship their feet. By considering themselves as Ishwar/God, they have become patit/impure. That is why father says- to uplift even these Saadhus/saints, I come.

So- Baba is saying- By making others worship themselves or their feet, lowkik Saints have removed God and have placed themselves on the seat of God- which is a great sin. So- they too need liberation.

4) The point is not to criticise anyone, just to throw some light on the gradual degradation of the world after Copper Age. Baba even praises lowkik saints for their pure life as well as effort -

SM 11-10-89(3):- BABA KAHTE, LAADLEY BACHCHON- APNEY KO ATMA SAMAJH BAAP KO YAAD KARO TO VIKARM VINAASH HO. ……BAAP KI YAAD MAY SHWAAS BHI SUKHELAA HO JAAYEGAA. BRAHMGYANIYON KI SHWAAS BHI SUKHELAA ….KHAAVO, PIYO, BAAP KO YAAD KARO TOH ANTH MATI SO GATI HO JAAYEGI. -15- vvimp[yaad]

= Baba says, lovely children, consider yourself as soul and remember father so that your sins get burnt.. In father's remembrance, even the breath would become blissful. The breath of brahmagyaanis is also blissful. ....Eat, drink, remember father, then it will lead to anth mati, so gathi (as the state of mind during last stage, so would be the destiny/future.

5) But, some of the saints are likely to give wrong knowledge, and make devotees worship their own feet, and

Every human being - be it be- saints or the so-called Jagadgurus too degrade, and God HIMSELF has to incarnate/descend to protect all. This is the point.

6) A murli point says- Manushy ko Bhagavaan kahney se Bharat kaa bedaa doob gaya hai = Boat of Bharata/India sink due to considering human being as God.

So- initially, worship was of just one Shiva. Then deities. May be sometimes later, females used to consider her husband as God. But, that is still limited to individual only. So- God's seat is not so polluted. Later when lowkik Gurus took seat of God, the whole society God degraded, and God's value/conscious in people's mind got even low.

7) But, there is also a murli point saying- aajkal gruhsthiyon ko bhee Guru karthay hain. Jo pavitr naheen hai, unko Guru karney se kyaa faaydaa hai = Today people make even gruhasthis (married people) as Gurus. What is the use of making impure(those who do not follow at least celibacy) ones as Gurus?

But, some lowkik Gurus say- "Until you become slave of a (human) Guru, you cannot get liberation. They even say- if God gets angry over you, Guru will protect you. But, if Guru gets angry over you, even God will not protect you".
In this way, as per drama plan, God got defamed to greatest extent which is another cause for downfall of India.

8) But, baba has also said- "Aaj bhee saatvikathaa hai toh isee dharm may hai na= Even today, if there is some saatvikataa(purity, platonic, passive, etc), it is still in this(Hindu) religion itself, is it not?" [In some countries, people eat frogs, lizards, snakes, even insects. Adultery, etc are much common there].

Baba even says- Bharat jaisaa puny bhoomi aur koyi hotaa naheen = There is no more holy land than India.

Baba has also said- two pure religions are deity and saint religions. So- saints are also to be respected. Even the whole world has degraded, not just India.

So- there is nothing to get upset or feel bad about anyone. It is drama. Baba is making us to understand drama in broad way.
Murli Pt:- Gambheerataa se full marks jamaa hota hai. Mamma toh gambheerataa kee devi thi. = The virtue seriousness gives full marks. Mamma was a deity of seriousness.


Posts: 2481
Link with BKs: BK
Post No. 213) A thought on BHAKTI MEMORIALS/YAADGAARS:-

1) Baba says- (majority of the) bhakti memorials are related to Conf. Age. And, we know them.
But, some people worship even snakes- when it is actually enemy/vices! I had been surprised. People burn effigy of RAVAN, but worship SNAKE. [Even though Ravan = Snake!]

2) But, I got a satisfactory explanation when found the murli point No. 1) saying- in Post No. 79 - "The souls like Chandika Devi also get worshiped, because such souls receive God's lap". - http://www.brahmakumarisforum.net/chat/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1167&p=11517#p11517,

So- I think, the case is similar here. Snakes/vices become like slave to Shiv/Shankar/yogis, because they have victory over them. But, people without practically knowing the significance, have placed the snake as a decoration to Shiv/Shankar/yogis.

Now- since the snake is placed/shown as a DECORATION, the devotees might had thought to worship it- by assuming that it is also a part of Shiv. [/b]

3a) Another example is - People ring bill in front of statues of God in temples. Ringing bell is a symbol of AWAKENING. Does God need to be awakened? Definitely No.
It is actually God who rings the bell (of knowledge) to wake us. But, in turn, the ignorant/innocent devotees are ringing bell to God!

3b People do ABHISHEK(pouring water, milk, etc) on statues of Shivling or deities. But, actually, it is God who pours water/milk of knowledge on us. God does not need it.

What God performs on us, the devotees perform it on God- due to not having clear understanding.

4) People worship even trees. Baba has already given the reason. One who gives is like a devtaa (deity) . Hence people worship even nature, and believe even them to be deities, as the nature sustains our life.

5) So- bhakti yaadgaars have essence, but due to not having right knowledge, some of the yaadgaars may be totally silly/foolish. Hence Baba says- the truth in bhakti things is to the extent- "aatey may namak (salt in the flour)".

More on bhakti scriptures is given here - journey-from-beginning-part-four-t1438.html
Murli Pt:- Gambheerataa se full marks jamaa hota hai. Mamma toh gambheerataa kee devi thi. = The virtue seriousness gives full marks. Mamma was a deity of seriousness.


Posts: 2481
Link with BKs: BK
# Post No. 214) Attribution of souls to (bodily) RELIGION:-

1) While giving introduction of soul, when we say- "Soul is above/beyond religion, above gender, above colour, above age, etc",, it implies as if soul is beyond all dualities.

----But, Baba has also said- even in Paramdham, souls will reside in different sections as per their religion.
[ which reminds the worldly saying- "All are equal, but some are more equal". ]

2) As human beings, we all are like identical/same. Our body structure is same . So, we fall into SAME category.

---But, still we discriminate ourselves as- Indian, American, etc.

3) The earth/nature is common. What air we breathe, the water we drink are is same either in India or America or any country.

----But, still we have divided the planet as different continents and countries!

4) As human beings, we all have common principles - and call them as human values, human rights, etc.

---But, still as per their country's status, currency value would be different as per their nationality!

---Even in one country or organization, according to the level/position of the person, his authority, responsibility accountability and remuneration are different.


5) Excellent explanation"- Even though we all fall into the same category HUMAN BEINGS, the BIOMETRICs like- fingerprints, DNA, etc, are unique to everyone. So- everyone is unique.

That is why Baba also says- "Feature of everyone is difference. Part of every soul is unique in drama"

So- on common/general level, we all are same. But, as we move deeper, there are are various groups, and finally at the LAST LEVEL, every individual is unique. So- nature and taste of every soul is unique in the final level.


6) SM 17-05-2017:- हर एक का अपना-अपना धर्म और अपना धर्म शास्त्र है। तो हर एक को अपना धर्म शास्त्र ही पढ़ना चाहिए। अपना धर्मशास्त्र ही कल्याणकारी होगा। तुम बच्चे जानते हो कि हम बरोबर ऊंच कुल के हैं। जब तक तुम मनुष्यों को ड्रामा का राज नहीं समझायेंगे, तब तक तो वह घोर अन्धियारे में हैं, इसलिए इन चित्रों पर भी समझाना चाहिए। तुम बच्चे सभी युगों को जानते हो, सिवाए चित्रों के मनुष्य समझ न सकें। बुद्धि में बैठेगा ही नहीं।

= “Everyone has his own religion and own religious Scripture. Everyone should study ONLY his own religious Scripture. There will be benefit ONLY in their own religious Scripture. You Children understand that we definitely belong to the HIGHEST clan. Until You explain the secrets of Drama to human beings, they will remain in TOTAL darkness. Therefore, you should explain using these pictures. You Children know all the Ages, but human beings will not understand without the pictures; it will not sit in their intellects.”

7) Like Baba says- "Devotees of deities (eg- Hanuman, Ganesh, etc) would not be satisfied even if I give vision of MYSELF. So, I give them vision of the faith what they have".

8) So- when Baba directs everyone to follow his own religion, I believe - the taste/capacity of the souls is number-wise and limited to their own respective religion. So- for them, the best advice is to follow their own religious scriptures.

9) That is why Baba clearly says-
---"I do not come in the cycle, you come in the cycle".
--- "Even though I enter in this body, my name never changes(The name Shiv does not get diluted)". [Because Shivbaba is so pure. But, when we enter into a body or even when ShivBaba enters into dada lekhraj, his previous name gets diluted, loses value. ]
--- "No one will get hundred marks, it is reserved for one Shivbaba/God (Post No. 128) ".

10) That is why Baba also says- "While doing service, first preference is to give message to devotees of Shiv and deities. They are the ones who are most likely to accept this knowledge. The next preference is to other religions. Those who (had been deities in heaven and) have got converted to other religions (after Copper Age) will easily develop faith and return to our own (deity) religion".

Thus we can see ShivBaba having highest esteem as well as giving full/right respect to all the religions.
Last edited by mbbhat on Sun Oct 08, 2017 8:49 am, edited 2 times in total.
Murli Pt:- Gambheerataa se full marks jamaa hota hai. Mamma toh gambheerataa kee devi thi. = The virtue seriousness gives full marks. Mamma was a deity of seriousness.


Posts: 2481
Link with BKs: BK
# Post No. 215) Is DEITY religion (or Bk philosophy) is truly spiritual?:-

12) All the religions speak about soul and God, but are more attached to body than soul.

But, DEITY religion is a perfect/best balanced religion. It is based on both soul and body. There is synchronicity between soul and body/nature.
In other religions KARMA(actions or external state or appearance, etc) is given higher preference then DHARMA (religiousness, say inner state). But, in deity religion, there is balance.
Since there is balance, deity religion can be called as truly/highly SPIRITUAL.

13) In heaven, there would be no scriptures.
Mostly- in heaven, there would be no name like- DEITY RELIGION aka Adi Sanaatan Devi Devtaa Dharm (ASDDD). I think - even the word RELIGION would also be absent there. Because, people/deities are naturally religious/pure.
That is why when we deities fall into Copper Age, will not be aware of what our religion is. Then later when other religions call them/us later in Copper Age as Hindus, they/we adopt that name. Because if we see- there is no name Hindu religion or deity religion in any of the Hindu scriptures.

So- since deities are neither dependent on the religion/scripture. nor have ego of their religion, there would not be such names there.

So- I believe - it is NOW most beloved knowledgeful Shivbaba is telling us that ASDDD is the name that fits for the highest religion.

Adi = Beginning
Sanaatan = Santaan = Children
Devi Devtaa = (Women) Goddess and (Man) God.
Dharm = Religion.

14) Murli point:- "Devtaa dharm natural life ke aadhaar par sthaapan hotaa hai. Aur dharm vaani ki shakti ke dwaraa sthaapn hote hain. = The deity religion gets established due to natural life. The other religions get established due to power of speech".

15) In other religions- even if a person commits sin or goes against his religious principles/scriptures, he still continuous to be a member of the same religion.
But, in deity religion, whenever the deities commit sins, it gets praayalop (vanishes) and the the title/name HUMAN will automatically sit on the head of everyone after Copper Age.
[Of course, deities are also "(godly or divine) human", but in ordinary usage, human means one who has vices. Since deities are much above other humans, they have the title DEITIES or god and goddess.

16) The saying- "RELIGION is MIGHT" - fits best to deity religion, since during the period of deity religion, there would be only one religion, independent and fully/naturally stable.
--In other context (lower level), it fits to all the religions as well. If one follows basic principles of his religion honestly he will definitely be a good and stable person.

17) Another uniqueness of the deity religion is- Usually many religions believe when their followers would be enjoying in heaven, others would be suffering in hell.
But, deity religion says- when their followers would be in heaven, the rest all will be in liberation.

So- during the period of deity religion, no one would be suffering. So- in fact, it is fully non violent, and respects every religion, hence purely spiritual.

18) Murli/Baba has also said- "You should have no desire even to go to heaven. [Post No. 48 - viewtopic.php?f=25&t=1167&start=50#p4590].

[That means - we should feel that we go to heaven as per our role bound in drama.]

19) Baba has also said -
---"Brahman parivaar ka loklaaj ko bhee chodnaa hai = The LOK_LAAJ/tradition of Brahmin/BK life should also be sacrificed. "
-----As well as - " Sacrifice even Godly happiness ".

20) Further, as per BK philosophy (murli)- just 8(or 108 ) only pass without any punishment, all the rest of the BKs will receive punishment number-wise. And, for any mistake/sin punishment for BKs is multifold (100 times) when compared to others.

So- all these clearly imply - BK teachings are above body and all the religions. Hence it is toughest and just 108 pass in it without any punishment.
Last edited by mbbhat on Wed Aug 23, 2017 5:28 am, edited 1 time in total.


Posts: 2481
Link with BKs: BK
# Post No. 216) Science vs Religion, Humanity vs Spirituality:-

1) Some people who are worldly intellectual and atheists believe/claim to- " Religion is cause for all conflicts. Religion has caused many wars. Hence religion should be completely abandoned".
Their another argument is- "Religious practices such as rituals are just blind faith and cause lot of wastage of money". That is true to some extent. *
But science has invented mass destructive weapons such as atomic and hydrogen bombs. But even then we cannot discard or abandon science.

2) Both science and religion have positive and negative effects. Both of them are deeply rooted in the society. As already said above in post no. 214, there cannot be humanity in real sense in this world, because the whole planet is divided into different countries and currency as well as in every country there are different classes of people having different incomes. So, their argument loses the value.

3)The the positive and negative effects of science are easily distinguishable, but that of religion are not as easy. And people are not open to discuss the religious matter**.
If research is done to discriminate the positive and negative effects of scriptures it would be good. To some extent it is happening.
[ Mu point( in almost right words) - "Committee banaanaa chaahiye , check karey ye shaastr kahaan tak right hai = committees should be made to check to what extent the scriptures are correct.]

4) Anyhow - we all know that- like negative effects of science will be used for destruction similarly the negative effects of religion would also be a cause for the same.
And the positive effects of both science as well as religion will come to heaven as per drama plan.

*5) Just for discussion ( not important)- Even though some religious practices lead to lot of waste, much more waste are done in in the name of entertainment and sports, tourism, etc and the technological advancement has made these wastages multifold. Wars are not due to just religious issues. Many wars have occurred due to political and economic issues.
So any one sided argument will not have effect and drama will move itself.

**7) Even though science is a tool for major research, and has made many development, still it has not been able to explain either soul or time cycle. It is only role of God who can do this which is the real service.

So, unless we are spiritual, we cannot be human beings in real sense.
Last edited by mbbhat on Mon Oct 09, 2017 4:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
Murli Pt:- Gambheerataa se full marks jamaa hota hai. Mamma toh gambheerataa kee devi thi. = The virtue seriousness gives full marks. Mamma was a deity of seriousness.


Posts: 2481
Link with BKs: BK
# Post No. 217) Essence, Knowledge and Information:-

1) ESSENCE is the most important which never loses value. It is the goal or ultimate benefit in life.
KNOWLEDGE is like boat and/or path to reach the goal.
INFORMATION is like side scenes on either sides of the path some of which may be useful, some may not be.

2) Suppose, say- A person is a doctor and an EYE SPECIALIST. He had studied many subjects in his career. These are like KNOWLEDGE. But finally, he does not need to keep all those subjects in his intellect. Only those related to EYE would be enough for him in his profession. Those subjects are like ESSENCE to him.
Anything else fall under the category INFORMATION. Some information are related to the profession and some are supportive too. We should have power of discrimination to absorb the useful/relevant things/data from the available information/materials/relations.

3) So- it is evident that as a person progresses, his present KNOWLEDGE becomes obsolete and fall into the category just INFORMATION.

4)When a new technology comes, the older version becomes just obsolete/information. In our yagya, initially, there was need of trance, and 14 years of YOG BHATTI. But for later generation, it is not necessary.

5) That's why Most beloved knowledgeful Almighty Shivbaba has also said- "in the end, pictures, songs, etc would not be necessary. Just ALAF(father) and BEY (property) would be enough. You children would become naturally powerful".

Essence is nothing but health, wealth, happiness, and above all these is self esteem.
Murli Pt:- Gambheerataa se full marks jamaa hota hai. Mamma toh gambheerataa kee devi thi. = The virtue seriousness gives full marks. Mamma was a deity of seriousness.

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